People's Champion Tournament: Round 1, Division 2 (Voting/Discussion)

Welcome to the second part of the opening round of the People’s Champion Tournament! (See here for details and ground rules. New players can join at any time.)

This post is for Division 2’s first round matchups. All matches were made at random.

Match 09: Lime Ergot vs. CC’s Road to Stardom

  • Lime Ergot
  • CC’s Road to Stardom
0 voters

Match 10: Perdition’s Flames vs. Nightfall

  • Perdition’s Flames
  • Nightfall
0 voters

Match 11: A Dark Room vs. A Change in the Weather

  • A Dark Room
  • A Change in the Weather
0 voters

Match 12: The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch vs. Over Here!

  • The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch
  • Over Here!
0 voters

Match 13: Taco Fiction vs. Eidolon

  • Taco Fiction
  • Eidolon
0 voters

Match 14: Inevitable (2003) vs. Word of the Day

  • Inevitable (2003)
  • Word of the Day
0 voters

Match 15: The Edifice vs. Pogoman GO!

  • The Edifice
  • Pogoman GO!
0 voters

Match 16: Sand-dancer vs. The Mystery of Winchester High

  • Sand-dancer
  • The Mystery of Winchester High
0 voters

Vote in the matchups above, and promote your selections on this thread. Voting will close and Round 1 for Division 3 will begin in two weeks.

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These are my initial thoughts:

Lime Ergot and CC’s Road to Stardom are both short, well-written games with some neat features. Lime Ergot is super influential (in that quite a few games are based on it, many of which themselves were successful, and it’s been mentioned in dozens of threads on this forum), but was written really fast and is sparse. CC’s Road to Stardom is less known, but it has great pixel art and polish.

Nightfall and Perdition’s Flames is a matchup between two masters of TADS: Mike Roberts and Eric Eve. Perdition’s Flames is so old it predates Inform (or is close to the release of Inform), which for the games that show up on this forum that aren’t commercial, that’s pretty old. It’s fun and funny, but firmly in that time period. Nightfall is also firmly in its time period, a polished game that came out around the time of Lost Pig and Violet, with tons of custom responses, smooth synonyms and command recognition, and character-driven story (in this case, a character who isn’t there).

A Change in the Weather vs Dark Room is a real toss-up, but I see it being pretty one-sided (I just don’t know which side yet). A Change in the Weather the hardest IFComp winner, and to me represents one of the biggest influences that led to story-focused (and eventually puzzle-light) gameplay. A Dark Room, though, is a brilliant and innovative clicker-type game that is really fun. This really is apples to oranges, so I think it will come down to whether this audience is more of an apple-audience or an orange-audience.

Over Here! and Lost Labyrinth are both nostalgic old-school games, but in very different ways. Over Here! is a text-light pixel art-heavy Adventuron game packed with dense puzzles in a very symmetric grid of rooms with minimal story. Lost Labyrinth is a sprawling and, well, Labrynthine game that does have a lot of puzzles but is more story-focused and has a more linear playstyle (only when compared to Over Here!).

Taco Fiction is Ryan Veeder’s breakout hit and has a ton of the things that people love about his work, like fun text effects, dynamic characters, side material that is highly implemented despite not mattering for the ‘speedrun’ path, and funny, unexpected game moments. Eidolon is a haunting game that stirs up childhood fears and has great atmosphere. It’s Twine, and long. I’m holding off on voting here until I replay these games.

Inevitable is a game by Kathleen Fischer, who, to me, is the best ‘lesser-known’ author. She has 3-4 great games, nice puzzles, cool atmosphere, but never won a big award and isn’t discussed much now. This game is her best puzzler, and is in the genre of ‘explore alien ruins and experience memories’. Word of the Day, on the other hand, is a sci fi murder mystery game set on a spaceship where someone has sabotaged everything. Both have a lot of great worldbuilding.

The Edifice is an early IFComp winner where you ascend different tiers of a monolith (which I’ve been told is not inspired by 2001) to experience different parts of the evolution of humankind, and is most famous for a language puzzle. This is in stark contrast to Pogoman GO!, which is highly technology-focused and features both a parody pokemon minigame (which takes up a huge amount of code) and a villainous Elon Musk. I’m going to replay here, too, before voting.

The Mystery of Winchester High is a Garry Francis highschool investigation game that, if I remember, has some puzzles that use the same objects in multiple ways and has some good polish and investigation. Sand-dancer is Aaron Reed’s tutorial programming game from his book, and includes a lot of compelling characters and vivid cutscenes.

A lot of tough decisions here, and some votes I’ve already cast I’ve thought of switching. Should be fun!

7 Likes

This segment’s contestants were nominated by the following people (in alphabetical order):

  • AmandaB
  • BadParser
  • CMG
  • Denk (x4)
  • dfranke (x2)
  • Hidnook

… plus others who submitted their nominations by PM (but can claim their nominees publicly if they like). It looks like the random assignments to divisions lumped nearly all of Denk’s nominees into this division. (Denk was one of the two lucky fans for whom all five nominees were selected in the lottery.)

Fans are encouraged to speak up for their nominees (yes, including you!) – discussion makes a difference!

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Agh! I’ve only just started playing Taco Fiction. I voted for all the other matches, and I expect to fill my ballot with that final vote in the next few days.

Also, shamelessly rooting for one of my favourite games of all time: Inevitable is a magnificent game. Hard, almost Myst-like puzzles, with a deeply moving background story that emerges as you progress.

3 Likes

Wow, I picked the right time to randomly check the forums. You all are playing ‘The Edifice’ again! w00t!

It’s always amusing to see people assume again that it was inspired by 2001 (which I hadn’t seen at the time), when it actually was inspired by a completely different movie: Why Man Creates by Saul Bass. Or at least my hazy recollections of it; they showed it to us in grade school 2-3 times between 4th and 6th grades. That and the game ‘Civilization’ (not Civ II mind you; just ‘Civ’) form the basic seed of the idea that grew into The Edifice.

I’ll have to play Pogoman GO! in the spirit of the Tournament. Thanks, organizers and random person who nominated my game!

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Some quick polls:

Compared to the last segment, I’m finding that making decisions for these matches is…
  • easier
  • about the same difficulty
  • harder
0 voters
By which method(s) do you most often learn about new IF that you decide to try?
  • entrants in competitions and jams
  • new game listings on IFDB
  • new review listings on IFDB
  • polls on IFDB
  • recommended lists on IFDB
  • searching by keyword on IFDB
  • “10 random games” listing on IFDB
  • seeing announcements on this forum
  • seeing discussion on this forum
  • word-of-mouth from other players
  • via some other site related to IF
  • searching the web
  • a method not listed here
0 voters
1 Like

I voted for “a method not listed here” which was “competitions”, although that might overlap with “games announced here”.

1 Like

I marked up three options, all via IFDB: random games, polls, and recommended lists.

My number one method for discovering new games however is browsing the IFDB list with the help of a sufficiently vague search (“published: 2001-2007” for example).

Somehow, for me, competitions don’t count. Games from IFDB or the Internet Archive or… are treasures I unearthed myself. Competition entries are games that are handed to me, disqualifying them as things I found.

(Of course, searching IFDB and compiling a list of games that came 5th in IFComp between 2005 and 2015 does count as stuff I found myself…)

1 Like

@rovarsson: To clarify, I meant “find new IF to try” in the more generic sense of learning about works and deciding to try them, as opposed to necessarily having set out in that moment to select one. (But your answer is fine!)

@mathbrush: I absolutely should have listed “via competitions,” which I can’t believe I left out. Since there were only a couple of answers, I’ve reset that poll (and expanded the number of allowed choices).

1 Like

Okay, will have to be brief for now, but as I was lucky to get all nominees included, here are some thoughts:

The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch:
I have been on board with the ADRIFT Alaric Blackmoon games close to the beginning. I started first playing Axe of Kolt, then Spectre of Castle Coris and Fortress of Fear. All quite hard parser puzzle games. After those I started beta-testing most of the games in the series. They are old school so I decided for this tournament to choose one of the less cruel games and still one of the best ones. I especially like the spell casting system - great fun without heavy themes.

Over Here!
I was blown away by the great minimalistic graphics and the easy game play despite being a two-word parser. High quality!

A Change in the Weather
I kept thinking about this game for a long time. Not sure why it was so addictive, considering the relaxed slice-of-life setting. It must be very well done.

Pogoman Go!
I hope players get into the tower before they start to rate this game, as this is where this comedy really shines. It starts being a lot less to do with Pogomon parodies when you get there.

4 Likes

Oh, right. I forgot to mention that I have completed the ballot for this round. Taco Fiction was great! Quite the deep dive from its rather mundane beginning… and then it twists again!

3 Likes

I just replayed Eidolon, and I can see why I liked it so much in the past (and nominated it here). I remembered that it has no save feature and is really long, so I gave myself some time to play through it.

For me, I think Taco Fiction is for sure the better game and possibly better story, but for me Eidolon isn’t in the same category as ‘game’ or ‘story’; I find it more in the realm of ‘things that transformed me in a way’ or ‘major life events’, just because I really resonate with it. It’s kind of like when I was a kid, and I only had two CDs I played over and over again: the soundtracks for Practical Magic and Dirty Dancing. I’ve never seen Practical Magic, but those soundtracks became ‘the’ songs that I knew and grew up on. Showing them to someone else wouldn’t be as meaningful because it is the combination of the time, place, my interests, circumstances, and the music that made them beloved to me.

That’s the way Eidolon is. Looking through reviews, many people have become frustrated with it (even my initial review), while others really enjoy it. It’s special to me but not in a way I think everyone should agree with.

Taco Fiction is fun and cool in a way I think everyone should agree with; it’s the kind of game where even if you didn’t like it you could still say ‘this is impressive/fun’.

So, I think it should win the round, but my personal vote will be for Eidolon.

7 Likes

My method not listed here is “via IFDB reviews”. I like reading reviews of games I have played, and often times they’ll mention the game is inspired by or reminds the reviewer of another game, or compare it to the author’s other work, and I’ll think hey that other game sounds interesting too and put it on my list.

4 Likes

I clearly didn’t spend enough time thinking up options! I think that’s close enough to “new reviews” to count, since they’re new to you.

I’m guessing that other “other site” some people voted for was CASA?

EDIT: Another method that occurs to me is using tags on IFDB; if anyone was looking for that option on the list, it can be counted as “keyword search on IFDB”.

1 Like

I voted for “other site” as I rarely use IFDB, except when looking for info on a particular game. As a historian, I scour the internet for info on text adventures. In my case, I was interpreting “new” as being new discoveries for me, not new releases. For “other sites”, I was indeed thinking of CASA, but also various Facebook groups and Discord servers, itch.io, Moby Games, IF Archive, Internet Archive, IFWiki and dozens of retro game archives.

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I have sometimes used the search box on textadventures.co.uk as there are also lesser known games there, which are not on IFDB.

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Does anybody know whether The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch has any problems under Frankendrift?

I know that it’s possible to play the game using Webrunner, but I’d prefer to play it with a local client. I’ve never used Frankendrift and will skip downloading it if it turns out to cause problems for this game.

Fun fact: Both The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch and Over Here! were nominated by Denk, the second time that two games sharing a nominator have been pitted against each other. The first time was Six vs. Alabaster (both nominated by Joey), though in that case Six was also nominated by mathbrush. I don’t see any other cases of that happening in Round 1.

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Are you using Windows? If so, The Lost Labyrinth of Lazaitch runs fine with ADRIFT Runner.

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I nominated A Dark Room. I’ll just say that the beginning gameplay is very repetitive but it opens up later. Ideally, one would play the entire thing because the story is sparse and doesn’t reveal itself until near the end. It is partly an incremental/idle/clicker game, so it should be played in the background and checked up upon every now and then instead of being played in one sitting (at least in the early game).

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No. Sorry, I should have specified Linux.

I did download Frankendrift 0.7, and it seems pretty comparable to WebRunner for at least the first few moves. We’ll see how it holds out. (If there’s any issue, I guess it might be possible to get the normal Runner working with WINE?)

Thanks to @ArdiMaster for building this interpreter!

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