Version Control and Workbench

[TheBloke]

@bcressey

@TheBloke

So I see clear general benefits of such a move. But there’s an even more compelling reason. By extending an existing IDE framework to support TADS, one could instantly - with little if any additional work - open up TADS development to non-Windows platforms.

The biggest obstacle to TADS development on non-Windows platforms is the myth that you need Workbench to do TADS development.

I agree completely that you don’t really - but I think most non-technical users want/like having an IDE to hold their hand. And things like integrated debugging are definitely useful.

To put it another way - the users most likely to want a hand-holding IDE and to never have to touch the command line are also exactly the same users likely to be daunted by TADS’ complexity. They would therefore be doubly put-off with the combination on non-Windows platforms.

I agree though that some expanded documentation or better packaging of the existing non-Windows tools could go some way to alleviating that.

[Erik_Temple]

@bcressey

The biggest obstacle to TADS development on non-Windows platforms is the myth that you need Workbench to do TADS development.

Well, up until recently, FrobTads was presented on the TADS website purely as a command-line interpreter, not as a compiler. Even if you clicked on a link that said FrobTads was for writing TADS games, the informational page for FrobTads mentioned nothing about the compiler. So the myth was strongly reinforced, if not created, by the TADS site itself…

Of course, someone with no technical background is also not going to figure out how to set up the environment without a friendly guide. Is there such a guide?

[bcressey]

@ektemple

Of course, someone with no technical background is also not going to figure out how to set up the environment without a friendly guide. Is there such a guide?

Once you’ve installed the FrobTADS package for OS X - which is recommended by the new-in-3.1 download guide feature - you should be able to follow along with the Getting Started book.

@TheBloke

To put it another way - the users most likely to want a hand-holding IDE and to never have to touch the command line are also exactly the same users likely to be daunted by TADS’ complexity. They would therefore be doubly put-off with the combination on non-Windows platforms.

I should clarify that when I referred to posturing, I meant my own statement that the need for Workbench was a myth. I agree that IDEs are a useful tool and that the lack of cross-platform support is problematic.

I think it sends a message to Mac / Linux users that they’re not wanted or that they’ll find a sub-par experience. Speaking as a Mac user, I haven’t found that to be the case, nor have I found Workbench to be very useful. On Windows, I wouldn’t even bother installing it if it weren’t the easiest way to get the toolchain loaded.

The two major myths that kept me away from TADS 3 for three years were that the language was a lot like Java and that Workbench was an indispensable tool. Neither has been true in my experience but arguably both are more off-putting to people who would really love TADS than the need to use the command line.

At the moment, I find it much easier to work with WebUI on OS X (where the command line gives me a URL that I can open in any browser) than on Windows (where the game is wrapped up in an HTML TADS frame running IE9 in the background).